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Welcome to The Sci-Fi Podcast, a wretched hive of scum and villainy a bi-weekly podcast focused on in-depth discussion of all things Science Fiction. The Sci-Fi Podcast features three hosts—Mattroid, Solo, and Station!—as well as frequent guests. Each episode we’ll look at a science fiction theme or franchise and take it where no one has gone before.
On this, the inaugural episode of The Sci-Fi Podcast, we’ll be talking very broadly about what it means to each of us to be sci-fi fans. We’ll also give you our individual Top 10 Science Fiction Movies lists as well as our Top 3 Sci-Fi Guilty Pleasures lists.
Theme music courtesy of I Hear Sirens, featuring Matt on Bass and Liz on keyboard. Hear more of I Hear Sirens ethereal, instrumental, post-rock at BandCamp. Podcast production and artwork by Joshua Ligairi who can be found podcasting at Movie Stream Cast, and Horror Movie Podcast. You can also follow him on Twitter @IcarusArts.
Show notes after the jump.
I. [00:00:00] INTRODUCTION
—Host, Mattroid, introduces the show
—Meet Co-hosts, Liz aka “Station!” and William “Solo” Jr
—Welcome guest and Producer, Joshua Ligairi from Movie Stream Cast aka “Wolfman Josh” from Horror Movie Podcast
—Mattroid introduces podcast concept and the first themed episode
II. [00:04:34] THEME DISCUSSION: “WHY SCI-FI?”
—Defining Science Fiction
—Perimeters of the podcast
—Science Fiction impact on culture
—Geeks and Nerds or not?
III. [00:35:27] LISTS: TOP 3 GUILTY PLEASURES
—The hosts defend their picks
—Find TSFP hosts’ Top 3 Guilty Pleasures lists in print: here
IV. [00:55:20] LISTS: TOP 10 SCIENCE FICTION FILMS
—The hosts defend their picks
—Find TSFP hosts’ Top 10 Science Fiction films in print: here
V. [01:18:00] SEGMENTS
—This week: “Captains Log” with Mattroid
Matt memorializes Leonard Nimoy and waxes philosophical about the impact of science fiction on his life.
VI. [01:24:00] WRAP-UP
—Sign-offs, plugs, and recommendations.
VII. NEXT
—Mattroid teases The Sci-Fi Podcast Ep 002: “The Chosen One in Science Fiction and Jupiter Ascending (2015)” with guest Cody Clark.
LINKS FOR THIS EPISODE:
—Read Matt’s writing for The Daily Herald newspaper as “Gary the Unicorn” on topics like FanX at heraldextra.com
—Watch Matt’s Gary the Unicorn comedy sketches about things like alien abduction on YouTube
—Listen to Matt discuss sci-fi / horror movies on the topic of “When Science Goes to Far” on Horror Movie Podcast
—Liz says to subscribe to The Sci-Fi Podcast on iTunes
—Listen to William and Josh discuss movies like Snowpiercer on Movie Stream Cast
—Listen to Josh dig deep on horror-themed episodes of Horror Movie Podcast
Pingback: LISTS: The Sci-Fi Podcast Top 3 Guilty Pleasures - The Sci-Fi PodcastThe Sci-Fi Podcast
“David’s more of a grovelling loser”
Ouch!
You guys are lucky that this podcast is good enough for you to get away with offending your audience members!
I’m loving the discussion so far, I find the whole “defining Sci-Fi” thing extremely fascinating. Unfortunately my head is all full of cold at the moment so my brain is working even less efficiently than usual meaning I have little commentary to interject at this point. But I’ll be back with more to say sometime soon.
Also, Matt mentioned a movie he saw but couldn’t track down about a guy stuck alone on Mars. It sounds a lot like “Robinson Crusoe on Mars” from 1964 to me.
It might be Robinson Crusoe on Mars, actually. I am having a hard time remember much of the movie (we’re talking 25-30 years ago when I saw it) but I will give RCoM a shot. If it’s the movie, I’ll find a way to repay your kindness.
“If it’s the movie, I’ll find a way to repay your kindness.”
No need for that, just keep making great podcasts.
If that’s the movie, I’d love to hear a review, Mattroid. Though, it sounds like the kind of movie that might pale on re-watch compared to your childhood memories.
I hope it was clear that I was actually mocking William for distinguishing between you as a “fan” and Matt as a “peer” opposed to mocking you, David.
Haha, I know Josh. I’m just kidding around.
That whole thing just came out wrong and weird. And Josh made it weirder.
Sorry about that David, I was just trying to be funny and give you props.
I didn’t make it weirder, I revealed the unintentional, but logical conclusions.
Haha, it’s okay guys. To be honest I was flattered that you acknowledged my part in the moniker although a little surprised that you didn’t go with William Robot Jr but I can see why; Solo sounds cooler and rhymes with Yolo.
Yeah! First comment on the entire podcast ever! Benefits of being the one posting the show.
Guys, great first episode. I listened back as I edited and you all did a great job. I think this show is going to be great. Can’t wait for the themed episodes. Liz, I’d never have guessed that this was your first podcast. Station!
I’m glad I didn’t give a list. I think I’m way outside the group here. But, that’s because I’m not a hardcore sic-fi guy.
To keep the STAR WARS controversy going …
William on Mattroid’s assertion that StarWars is a fantasy: “but there’s no wizard in a robe with a magic staff” Actually, William, I’d suggest that Obi Wan Kenobi fits that description. And then there’s Darth Vader as the wizard’s Dark Lord nemesis. Seems to fit the archetypes.
WOOHOO! So excited to see this up and running. Going to subscribe right now, and cut my teeth on some sci-fi goodness.
p.s. I (obviously) haven’t listened to the first episode yet (or, would we call it “Episode I” on this show?), but I’ve always considered Star Wars to be sci-fi/fantasy. Because, you know, that’s what it is.
Episode I; I had a hard time intentionally not calling it that. Ha ha. I can’t wait for you guys to listen and to (hopefully) love it.
Keep the feedback coming, of course.
@Josh – Are you going to setup this site for blog post and comment subscriptions? I’m sure it’s on the to do list, but wanted to mention it since it seems to really have helped with the conversation on the other sites.
Btw, awesome job setting up the site. It looks very “sci-fi,” especially the banner image.
Thanks, man. More to come. This will have the comment subscription functionality, for sure. Still under construction a bit. Pardon our dust.
@Josh – I like how you placed the MSC, MPW, and HMP buttons in the sidebar in three-course meal order.
You were the inspiration there, Dino.
“but there’s no wizard in a robe with a magic staff” Actually, William, I’d suggest that Obi Wan Kenobi fits that description. And then there’s Darth Vader as the wizard’s Dark Lord nemesis.
BAM.
I know I’m pretty bad at not finishing my jokes, thoughts and sentences (when I’m talking). And I was trying to expose myself when I said Star Wars has no wizard. Of course Obi-Wan is the wizard in the story. It (and he) is the “Meeting the Mentor” step from Joseph Campbell’s “The Hero’s Journey”.
I still stand by the notion, that by putting the Hero’s Journey in space surrounded and supported by science fiction, makes it a sci-fi movie.
Yeah, obviously. Matt’s crazy. Haha. Actually, I could easily buy a combination of the two like Dino pointed-out.
It’s such an interesting argument. I’ve heard folks categorise Star Wars as a Science Fantasy, a Space Western etc and I’ve heard it argued that the presence of The Force adds enough of an element of magic to the world so as to put it more in the Fantasy camp (rightfully ignoring that ridiculous Midichlorian nonsense!) but couldn’t you say that something as abstract as Love or Faith might also seem “Magical” enough to paint a film in fantasy colours?* Of course that’s the theory taken to its extreme logical conclusion but I think it brings to light the fault at it’s heart: Just because something is Science Fiction doesn’t mean it has to be totally and clinically scientific. What human story ever told is such a thing? Also how many episodes of Star Trek have we had that feature some kind of mysterious, unseen alien force?
Star Wars does certainly have a whole bunch of elements analogous to the classic Fantasy narrative though. Some have already been astutely pointed out but we also get The Princess in Distress, The Assault on the Castle, The Roguish Mercenary etc. William hit the nail on the head when he brought up The Hero’s Journey. It’s classic stuff just transposed to a universe of Science Fiction aesthetics and tropes but that doesn’t make it any less Sci-Fi to me. “Forbidden Planet” is roughly based on “The Tempest” by William Shakespeare but that doesn’t mean that it’s more of a 17th Century Comedy than it is a Sci-Fi movie.
I think the best argument to be made for Star Wars not properly fitting into the Sci-Fi genre is that it’s universe isn’t in some way scientifically rooted to our own. It shuffles off the limitations of our reasonable scientific speculations by emancipating itself from any association with the world as we see it. But to that I’d say: Don’t all films and stories in any medium do that to an extent? No film adheres actually and totally to the laws of our world as we know them. Even the most grounded movie has cuts and changes in character perception. But we understand that things operate differently when a narrative is being told as opposed to how an event might unfold before us in person. My point is that a fictional text can never be an absolute representation of reality, so the distancing of Star Wars from our own experience isn’t too far different than the way most stories work subliminally anyway. So I say it’s fine to call it Science Fiction but Fantasy also fits. Few films adhere strictly to the conventions of a single genre. If we can have Sci-Fi Horror, or Action Comedy then why can’t we have Fantasy Sci-Fi?
Also is the term “Speculative Fiction” used as a kind of cousin to Sci-Fi. Might that be what something like “Children of Men” could be classed as? It’s a film pretty lacking in the “Science” department but it certainly speculates with regard to how our not-to-distant future might turn out.
*I should point out that this thought is inspired by something Josh once said to me about The Force being an early inspiration for his faith in the things we can’t see or absolutely prove are there. Apologies, Josh, if my memory has butchered that wonderful notion!
Some excellent points, David. I admittedly don’t know where I stand with Star Wars, from a category standpoint. It’s certainly as Sci-Fi as it’s not, but it rings Fantasy to me more than anything.
We’ll continue to discuss it, I’m sure. I’ll make sure to check back and reference your comment, because there are some great tidbits. Josh has tidbits too, but they are hairy.
Well, Josh IS hairy, so…
I always find it hard to imagine guys with beards being jerks.
Maybe it’s because I’ve never seen my Dad without his beard. Do you guys think it would be unethical to sedate him and shave off his facial hair so I can see him without it once in my life. He’s getting on in years now!
You got my basic sentiment, David. Unfortunately, the rest of your comment is too brilliant for me to comment without exerting way more brain power than I am capable of at the moment.
@Josh – Is the show on iTunes yet? I can’t find it in the iTunes store, and the iTunes/Stitcher/RSS links on the homepage all seem to be tied to MSC. (I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that isn’t just a shameless ploy to grow your MSC audience)
You figured out my ploy! No, actually I just posted this late last night and the RSS, Netflix, Stitcher etc should be approved soon. Thank you guys for being early adopters!
UPDATE: The RSS feed is live if you like to subscribe that way. Stitcher should be a couple of days and iTunes, though hard to predict, should be anytime.
Thanks for the update, Josh.
Hey all, thanks for coming to the site and listening to the show. The show will be available for subscription via iTunes and Stitcher by tomorrow or so – it takes a couple of days to get approved.
Stitcher is live!
looking forward to it showing up on iTunes so that I can subscribe, listen, get offended and then never listen again!
Ryan W, huh? Sounds like a TROLL to me. A beautiful troll with great camera skills.
I troll because I care. Until I disagree with you, which looks like it will be often.
Holy… did I just hear correctly that Harrison Ford crashed his plane?! Sounds like he’s alive and alert, but geez…
Crazy. And just after he healed from his last injury.
He’s a clumsy old guy now.
No! It’s not true! I’ll never join you!
Yep, scary stuff. I hope he’s okay, at least okay enough to come to a comic-con near be before he croaks. Too soon?
I absolutely loved Liz’s point about Sci-Fi seeming to appeal to those who have faced some kind of adversity. I think those sort of folks tend to be a little more introspective than people who’ve always had it easy and Science Fiction is ultimately all about asking ourselves questions. A really awesome observation Station!
I’ll make sure she checks out the boards. I don’t know if she knows they exist yet.
Hearing the guilty pleasures and top ten lists was really fun and there were definitely some surprising choices. Liz’s top ten was especially bold. It’s cool to have a group of people who maybe aren’t going to agree all the time. I was especially shocked to see both “Prometheus” and “Alien³” get on two lists, neither of which contained the original “Alien” movie! Don’t you guys think that one’s an absolute masterpiece!?
Also, it was awesome to hear some love for the Underwater Science Fiction/Horror stuff from Matt. I’m a total sucker for these kind of movies and I know our good friend Juan is too. For me “Leviathan” and “Deep Star Six” are the King and Queen of the subgenre.
And finally, I decided to put together my own top ten and guilty pleasures lists but things all went a little Ligairi-esque and I ended up with a butt-load of honourable mentions:
Top Ten Sci-Fi Movies:
1. Bladerunner
2. Metropolis
3. Alien
4. Original Star Wars trilogy (this is probably cheating)
5. The Thing
6. Aliens
7. Total Recall
8. Jurassic Park
9. Brazil
10. District 9
Honourable mentions: Twelve Monkeys, Robocop, Forbidden Planet, The Fly, Terminators 1 & 2, Starship Troopers, Akira, Silent Running, Event Horizon
3 Guilty Pleasures:
1. Flight of the Navigator
2. Battle Beyond the Stars
3. A.I. Artificial Intelligence
Honorble mentions: Outland, Explorers, The Last Star Fighter
Great list, David. You’re making me want to make one.
Love all of your Top 10, but TOTAL RECALL would be a guilty pleasure and DISTRICT 9 wouldn’t make the cut. I’m a fan of all of your honorable mentions and guilty pleasure as well, some more than others. Never seen SILENT RUNNING and never heard of OUTLAND or BATTLE BEYOND THE STARS. I don’t see why A.I. is a guilty pleasure. It’s not great, but it’s not bad. BICENTENNIAL MAN is the kind of film I expect to see on a guilty pleasures list. MAC & ME goes on a guilty pleasures list, not a slightly disappointing realization of the combined-visions of two legendary filmmakers.
You’re surprised about the inclusion of ALIENS and PROMETHEUS, well I’m surprised by the overall passion about the ALIEN franchise around here, in general. I didn’t realize the films were so popular. The first one would make my list for sure and I appreciate the others, even the fourth, but they just don’t resonate with me that much for some reason.
Lots of controversy!
Alien is a masterpiece, and I love it. But I don’t like to rewatch it like I do like Aliens or Alien3 for some reason. It’s probably in my top 10, but my top 10 could look a little stupid if I didn’t separate things a bit–I could probably include Prometheus, Alien, Aliens and Alien3, Terminator and Terminator 2, Star Wars, Empire Strikes Back, and then…whoa, no room!
I HATE top anything lists because mine tend to change often. Thus, I have a hard time committing to them and I end up defending them like I’m doing now.
That said, your list is great, David. I’m so glad you like underwater sci-fi!
Oh, yeah, I love that underwater sci-fi/horror stuff as well. Been working on putting together an episode of HMP. I agree with both of Matt’s picks, by the way. They’re great, fun movies.
Fine, FINE, I’ll be a guest on that episode. Sheesh, badger me why don’t you.
Mac and Me isn’t a guilty pleasure, it’s just guilty.
Aside from the bit where the wheelchair guy goes off the cliff “Mac and Me” is an abomination.
No way is “Total Recall” a guilty pleasure. It’s simultaneously borderline moronic and total genius. The premise and plot are way too clever to be a guilty pleasure and an interesting and unique juxtaposition with Arnie’s meat-head performance and the over-the-top ultra-violence. It’s an awesome film.
“District 9” was a bit more problematic of an inclusion but I felt I needed at least one more modern film and that’s probably one of favourite films in the genre from the last decade. The social-commentary is heavy handed but it has a huge emotional weight to it and the film never feels like it’s making compromises to reach the widest audience possible; a problem that I find is all too common with a great deal of modern sci-fi stuff. Ultimately I could easily have swapped this movie out with “Twelve Monkeys”, “Robocop” or “Terminator 2” though.
You should definitely check out “Outland” and “Battle Beyond the Stars” Josh. “Battle” is pure B-movie Schlock but loads of fun and “Outland” is a great little hidden gem starring Sean Connery as a sheriff on a mining colony. It has those very lived-in, industrial aesthetics of the “Alien” movies and the only real reason I’d consider it a guilty pleasure is because it contains a few notable scenes of totally nonsensical physics throughout. And lots of folks shooting off regular firearms in big glass space buildings like it’s the smartest thing to do.
And “A.I.” is a movie that I hear a hell of a lot of disdain for so that’s why it went in the guilty pleasures bin. It’s a movie that I feel a little embarrassed about admitting I enjoy regardless of who worked on it. People really seem to hate that convoluted and schmaltzy ending. I think it’s the kind of film where I always feel the need to qualify my position as a fan by first noting it’s flaws, so that’s as close to a true guilty pleasure as I probably get!
I think “Alien” and Aliens” are widely regarded as two of the best Science Fiction films ever but the rest of the franchise isn’t generally held in such high regard which is why Matt and Liz’s lists surprised me so much. I can’t wait to hear them cover these movies fully in an episode!
And you should definitely do your top ten and guilty pleasures Josh. Even if you’re more of a spectator on this episode it’d still be great to get the context of your favourites of the genre. See if you can come up with as many honourable mentions as I did!
I have been meaning to watch “Silent Running”. Is “Battle Beyond the Stars” the one with the “Seven Samurai” style plot?
“Is “Battle Beyond the Stars” the one with the “Seven Samurai” style plot?”
That’s the one! It’s pretty shameless but I love it, especially John Saxon as the crazy bad guy. I also believe it was one of James Cameron’s earliest gigs working as the special effects guy!
And “Silent Running” is definitely worth checking out though some folks have a tendency to complain that it’s a bit slow. It’s a film very much entrenched in the early 70’s, complete with a plot about saving the last of earth’s forests which are stored on big cargo ships and regarded as disposable by the shipping company. It has very few characters and not a great deal of action but Bruce Dern is excellent as the lead and it has this slightly incongruent Joan Baez soundtrack.
David, I also really like your list. I think you made some less obvious choices with Jurassic Park and The Thing. I’m not sure that I would classify them as sci-fi just because they don’t “feel” that way to me, but they’re great picks nonetheless.
I second you on Total Recall. Clearly Josh is out of his element. I’d like to see his list so we can pick it apart haha. The only movie that you listed that I don’t like is Twelve Monkeys. I know it’s a beloved movie, but it didn’t do it for me. I guess a re-visit is in order.
Ok, I guess I have to do this.
@David – I love your inclusion of JURASSIC PARK. I never really considered that one science-fiction but, yeah, it does seem to actually fit.
The more and more I think of Star Wars, though, the less I see the sci-fi angle. I know I said earlier that I consider it sci-fi/fantasy, but now I’m leaning more towards just straight-up fantasy.
“The more and more I think of Star Wars, though, the less I see the sci-fi angle. I know I said earlier that I consider it sci-fi/fantasy, but now I’m leaning more towards just straight-up fantasy.”
This is interesting Dino. Here’s a question though; would you still feel that way if Tatooine was just Earth a million years in the future with the rest of the galaxy being colonies and alien homeworlds?
And what other movies can you think of that ride the line between Science Fiction and Fantasy so confusingly. I’d say “Dune” and, to a slightly lesser extent, “Krull” are similarly schizophrenic.
@David – See my rather long-winded response towards the bottom of the comments chain. In short, though, I’m beginning to feel the themes of a movie are more important in genre classification than surface elements.
Thanks for a great first episode! I have been looking forward to this ever since the HMP episode “When Science Goes Too Far” came out. The top ten discussion made me think about my favorites and I would be hard pressed to choose only ten. I will say that quite a few of them were already mentioned. “Blade Runner” and “The Fifth Element” are at the top of my list, and I have a deep fondness for “Logan’s Run” (it was one of the first sci-fi films I ever saw as a kid). I thought I would mention a few of my favorites that weren’t discussed in the episode. “American Astronaut” from 2001 is one I discovered with my husband last year and be both fell in love with it. It’s an avant garde space western musical. “Dark City” and “Close Encounters of the Third Kind” would also be on my list. If I were to pick some honorable mentions I would pick “Primer”, “Looper”, and “Total Recall”.
I have several movies that I love which could be categorized as guilty pleasures, but there is really no guilt involved in my affection for them. “Barberella”, “They Live” and “The Visitor” (aka “Stridulum”) are huge favorites for me. “The Visitor” is an especially strange movie, but it is shot beautifully and I occasionally have days where I just have to listen to the theme music from it. If I could have my own theme music, I would want something similar. (I included a link to the music, in case anyone is curious.) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3auMB1-3JM
This episode was thoroughly enjoyable and I am looking forward to the episodes to come.
Allyson! It’s Josh. Thanks for coming over. Your Gravatar is gone!
We’re already recording and planning a bunch of upcoming episodes and they only get better from here.
I’m absolutely with you on BARBARELLA, BLADE RUNNER, CLOSE ENCOUNTERS, PRIMER, and THEY LIVE. I guess I’ll have to go ahead and make a list of my own, now.
It’s been years since I’ve seen DARK CITY and I have never even heard of AMERICAN ASTRONAUT. It sounds unique and worth checking out, by your description. I think the musical element–although there are many I like–always worry me a bit going in.
Never seen THE VISITOR either. That music is amazing, though. Have you ever seen Roman Coppola’s CQ? As a fan of BARBARELLA (and what I can grasp of THE VISITOR), I think you might like it. It’s kind of a meta/satire about the making of a DANGER DIABOLIK, BARBARELLA-type movie. It’s really about a tortured artist. Model Angela Lindvall plays the star of the film inside a film and Jeremy Davies plays the filmmaker. It’s great, but it’s not for everyone. I think you’d appreciate it, though.
I like LOOPER and LOGAN’S RUN, but they wouldn’t crack a list. I’m kind of shocked the latter wasn’t on William’s list, as I already mentioned on the show. TOTAL RECALL might make a guilty pleasures list for me.
Hi Allyson, thanks for the listen and the feedback. You’ve got some awesome comments, and I love the movies you mention, especially Dark City, Primer and Close Encounters (all of which we will discuss over the course of the show).
Please keep listening and make sure to spread the word. I’ll make sure Station! and I check out “American Astronaut”.
I have seen “CQ”. My husband has a copy of it and showed it to me back when we started dating, and I really enjoyed the atmosphere in which it takes place. I am a sucker for the late 60’s/early 70’s vision of futuristic space.
“American Astronaut” isn’t a traditional musical, but the music is a key part of the story. It’s low budget and highly creative, but not everyone’s cup of tea. It is on hulu for free right now, but I would recommend watching it commercial free if you decide to watch it.
It looks like I put the wrong email down for my original comment, hence the missing Gravatar.
Ok! I’m checking it out!
“It’s kind of a meta/satire about the making of a DANGER DIABOLIK, BARBARELLA-type movie. It’s really about a tortured artist. Model Angela Lindvall plays the star of the film inside a film and Jeremy Davies plays the filmmaker.”
That sounds pretty amazing!
I’d be interested to hear what you think.
That music for “The Visitor” is so awesome.
Great job guys but I don’t see how Howard the Duck got snubbed on anyone’s best list. But seriously Eathan Hawk needs to make Explorers 2: Meet the Alien Parents, am I right??
Howard the Duck!
How could I have forgotten about this movie.
It definitely should’ve been in my guilty pleasure.
Sometimes you just gotta get your duck erotica on… am I right?
“Sometimes you just gotta get your duck erotica on… am I right?”
“No, that’s wrong. All wrong.”
No, that’s wrong. All wrong.
Awesome first episode! Loved it! And all 3 hosts had very interesting top-10 lists.
Looking forward to episode #2
Thanks Doc Shock. Coming from one of my favorite podcast voices, that’s a big time compliment.
Loved the first episode. Every other week I get a Horror and Sci-Fi Podcast – I’m in.
Station, If I were to make a top ten list of underrated Sci-Fi films, Predators would be if not right at the top very close to it, but better than the original Predator? Can’t wait to hear your opinion on that.
You make me want to give ‘My Stepmother is an Alien’ another shot. Pretty sure I haven’t seen that since I was a wee lad in the theater so really, what did I know?
Mattroid, I agree 100% on 2001 as the number 1 Sci-Fi film. And in fact, the original Planet of the Apes would be my number 2 – both of which were released in 1968. What a great and groundbreaking year for Sci-Fi. “Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep” was published that year as well I believe.
Solo, “You’ll Know it When You See It” works for me. The discussion on what is and what is not science fiction was brilliant and I hope all of you are not done with that discussion. Genre discussion is always interesting because people have so many different opinions on what is and what is not…
“Children of Men” is a great example. I’ve always thought “Alien” was a great example as well because while it’s in space and has many sci-fi elements it also follows the ‘Haunted House’ scenario to a tee. It could just as easily be considered horror and I tend to lean that way with it. I would argue that “Alien 3” is the only true science fiction film in the franchise (I believe “Aliens” leans more towards action/adventure and “Alien Resurrection” leans more towards fantasy or something – I’ve never really gotten that one).
Which brings me to “Alien 3.” Just do not get the love of this film. I will agree with Roger Ebert that it might be the best looking bad film of all time, but it’s still a bad film. The film feels like there were too many cooks in the kitchen (which we know there were) – this film is a strange combination of at least two screenplays and from what I understand elements from a few other drafts made their way in as well.
So many uninteresting and stock characters – the warden who seems like an okay guy until they need him to be a dick in the story is a prime example. And as much as I love Charles S. Dutton, his rambling messiah jailbird character adds nothing to the story line and just makes no sense.
There are so many oddly placed sequences – the attempted rape scene being the prime candidate. And the ending. Holy crap, the ending. If you were to put a list of things not to do in an Alien film, I would think (SPOILER ALERT!!!) make Sigourney Weaver pregnant with an alien would be number 1 on the list but I guess not.
But I look very forward to the Alien episode(s) where this is defended and from what I’ve heard in the first episode, your intelligent discussion very well might win me over. You’ve got me wanting to re-watch “My Stepmother is an Alien” so if that’s serious mind control I don’t know what is.
Can’t wait for Episode 2.
Yeah, “Alien³” is a pretty flawed movie for me too. I’m really looking forward to hearing why it’s getting so much love here. Maybe I’ve been too dismissive of it.
First of all, that was a great comment, Jonathan. I like all that you have to say, EXCEPT the Alien3 hate. I get where you’re coming from, but I can’t wait for you to say, “Huh, it IS a great movie!” after our review. You too David. Because you know why? It IS a great movie! (even though I get why it might not be to some)
Oh man! I’m super late for the party :/
I’m still listening, but so far it’s been great. I love all the movie references, but I have to give props to Station for picking that name and for including Bill & Ted’s Bogus Journey on her top ten list, which is one of my top sci-fi comedies of all time. EXCELLENT! *guitar riff*
By the way, here’s my list of top sci-fi movies of all time. I’m copying David’s format and include honorable mentions and guilty pleasures. Movies with an * I struggle to classify as sci-fi, but I’m recognize that the sci-fi element is strong in them. I did not include them in my top ten.
Top 10
1. Alien
2. Blade Runner
3. Aliens
3. 2001: A Space Odyssey
4. The Terminator
5. Inception
6. District 9
7. Ghost in the Shell
8. Minority Report
9. Starship Troopers
10. Donnie Darko
Honorable Mentions (There are so many great movies that I felt bad not including them)
1. Akira
2. Robocop*
3. Predator*
4. Back to the Future
5. Bill & Ted’s Bogus Journey
6. Terminator 2
7. Dark City
8. The Matrix
9. Contact
10. Interstellar
11. Sunshine
12. Gattaca
13. Prometheus
14. Robot & Frank
15. Mars Attacks!
Guilty Pleasures ( I don’t have guilty pleasures, but for the sake of having a list)
1. Equilibrium
2. Bicentennial Man
3. They Live
4. Galaxy Quest
5. The Core
I don’t know guys, this was extremely difficult. I still don’t feel 100% comfortable with my list. Does everyone else feel that way too?
I forgot about The Wraith. Add that to the very top of my honorable mentions m/
Don’t you mean very top of your guilty pleasures? 😉
Uh…yeah sure sir?
Bicentennial Man and The Core?! Those are some despicable choices, Juan! I hope you are very, very, very guilty. Even though Karl’s feet apparently appear in The Core. Haha. I think Jason likes that movie too. Wow.
Several controversial choices on your Top 10 list as well, but a good showing. I was surprised to see Contact on there and Interstellar so soon, but they are great picks. I’d like to hear some debate over District 9, Inception, Minority Report, Ghost in the Shell and ESPECIALLY Donnie Darko. I know that they are all beloved films, but I feel like they each had a big backlash at some point as well.
My favorites on your honorable mentions are Gattaca and Sunshine. Beautiful films.
I was surprised to see Robot & Frank on your list. I don’t remember hearing your thoughts on this when I covered it on MSC or when I made Karl watch it on MPW. Love that film and glad you gave it some love. It’s hard for me to include brand new films on lists like these.
I have a hard time FEELING like Predator is a sci-fi film too, although it obviously is, but RoboCop? Everything about that movie feels sic-fi to me.
Yeah, I’d be interested to hear Juan’s reasons for struggling to categorise “Robocop” as Science Fiction too!
These are great and really interesting lists though. Probably the only one that I’d struggle with placing on a top ten is “Inception”. That’s a ground-breaking and genius movie in a lot of ways but the actual telling of the story seems too bloated and over-long to me for it be one of the best.
Also, It’s really interesting to see so much love for “Gattaca” on this site. Maybe my perceptions are screwed up but I’ve always felt like that movie was extremely underrated even unfairly maligned in some instances. It’s a brilliant piece of cinema though and I’m glad to see lots of people recognising it.
And don’t listen to Josh about “Bicentennial Man” Juan, that guy gave me a hard time for having “A.I” in my guilty pleasures when it should apparently be held in higher regard. But “Bicentennial Man” feels in certain ways like a similar kind of film to me. I don’t mind it, it’s light and entertaining and manipulatively sad in a lifetime network sort of way.
I want to see Josh’s list now.
Also, I’ve never seen “Equilibrium”. Is it worth checking out. I’ve looked in into it before but got the impression it was another one of those post-Matrix style-over-substance martial arts/action/Sci-Fi type films which I’m not a big fan of. Am I being unfairly dismissive as usual?
No, I think you nailed it on your perception of Equilibrium, David.
I disagree with your critcisms of Inception, though. If I’d change anything about it, I’d only make it longer to learn more about JGL and EP’s characters, which were under-served by the story.
Yeah, Equilibrium is definitely more style over substance, but it’s a fun little action movie with a sci-fi backdrop. It stars Christian Bale and he is pretty good as the emotionless enforcement office. It probably helped him land the job for Batman. The standout of the movie is the martial art that was created for it. It’s called gun kata and it’s a mix of Wing Chun and gunplay. It’s really quite striking the first time you see it, but it does feel dated and silly by now. Anyway, I watched this when I was 20, man, of course I loved it hahaha. It’s a silly movie, David, but I still appreciate it for what it is. I’m not sure if it’ll be your cup of tea though.
“If I’d change anything about it, I’d only make it longer to learn more about JGL and EP’s characters, which were under-served by the story.”
But Josh, surely that’s testament to “Inception”s failings when it comes to narrative efficiency? How long is it? Almost two and a half hours and we still get glossed over characters?
It’s a problem I tend to find with most of Nolan’s movies actually. I think that he’s an exceptional filmmaker but I always come away feeling a little detached from the characters in his work. I almost wish he’d reign in the ground-breaking stuff a little and spend a bit more time just writing and filming interesting characters. That said I’ve yet to see “Interstellar” so maybe I’m speaking too soon?
You really think my picks are controversial? Whaaaaa? I know I included a lot of new films, but I feel like they’re all top notch movies that, if they’re not already, will be sci-fi classics that we’ll be talking about years from now.
Ok, Bicentennial Man is not that despicable, Josh. It’s a decent movie and like David said, it does manipulate Juan’s feelings in ways that I would’ve rather felt more organic. But I like it a lot, and neither this film nor The Core are as bad as Spice World, which you stayed strangely quiet about that choice. Makes me think that it’s also a favorite of yours. David, I also feel like A.I. is a similar film, but I think it’s far superior to B.M. I don’t think I would’ve necessarily categorize it as a guilty pleasure, but it’s nowhere near the top 10, maybe top 50 or even top 100.
Robocop… I don’t know, to me it’s a satire first and foremost, then an action movie, and then a sci-fi. I can’t tell you exactly why I struggle to call it a sci-fi, but it just doesn’t “feel” like one to me. If you’re to compare it to Starship Troopers —another satire from the same director—that movie “feels” like a sci-fi. I guess Robocop is too grounded in reality for me. I don’t know, I need more time to think about this.
I love Robot & Frank! It was one of my favorite movies that year (2012). It’s a movie I don’t hear many people talk about. It’s a shame because it’s great. It has a lot of heart and Frank Langella’s performance as well as the actor who plays the robot (I don’t want to spoil who it is) are phenomenal. They have incredible chemistry.
Predator just feels like a straight up Arnold movie. For me, there’s action movies and then there’s Arnold movies. Is that weird? I think it has to do with the fact that I was obsessed with his movies growing up. I must have seen Commando like 100 times. I mean, you just can’t beat this writing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nsm7ArnOGpA
I thought about including Independence Day, Men in Black, and Armageddon somewhere in either honorable mentions or guilty pleasures, but I couldn’t decide on what to do with them, so I just left them out. What do you guys think of them?
“A.I.” is definitely a much more visually engaging and stylishly made film than “Bicentennial Man” but I think they’re not only thematically related but also similar when it comes to being manipulative and “schmaltzy”.
Also, with regards to Independence Day, Men in Black and Armageddon, I’m afraid to say that I detest “Armageddon” passionately and “Men in Black” is a very weird one for me*. “Independence Day” has a nostalgic place in my heart though. Goldblum and Smith play extremely likeable characters and I feel like it’s an example of the directing being just restrained enough (well, about as restrained as Roland Emmerich gets) to keep everything together. All of his movies since then seem to be exactly the same thing just getting more and more over-the-top and convoluted each time.
*”Men in Black” is such a weird movie to me. I feel like it’s not really artful or quirky enough to be a cult classic (as opposed to something like “Ghostbusters”) but it has got a weird playfulness about it and that cheerful 90’s action vibe and I can’t really bring myself to hate it. It feels very mainstream and tailored for mass appeal but I guess that doesn’t necessarily make it a bad movie. It shows a bit more creativity and effort than lots of similar blockbuster movies.
Armageddon is so, so bad. I’m an Affleck apologist, I have a crush on Liv Tyler, and I like Owen Wilson in pretty much anything, but that movie is just … uuugh.
I like Men in Black in spite of myself and I agree with everything David said about it. Same with Independence Day.
There was just something about Will Smith in that era where he could turn everything he touched to gold. And, I don’t just mean financially. He had so much charisma, I just loved everything he was doing.
I loved Robot & Frank. And you’re right, you don’t hear it talked about very much.
It’s probably because there is not enough sex, action and blood.
@Juan – THE CORE… man, that’s one horrible movie that I absolutely enjoy watching. Great pick for a guilty pleasure.
I love these types of movies, Dino. I love them because I can jump in at any given moment and it’s ok, because they’re just a ride. That and they have some of the craziest, most ludicrous, so-bad-they’re-good ideas ever haha.
Yep… they’re good movies to fall asleep to, too. I love to throw one of those mindless movies on when I’m ready to doze off for the night.
Awesome first episode, Mattroid!
I am excited to be regular listener of this. Glad to see some of the HMP amigos here as well! So good to hear people give proper respect to Aliens, Blade Runner, and 2001: A Space Odyssey; these are two of the greatest films ever to me.
I hope you guys eventually get into detailed analysis of Kubrick’s “2001”. That is the best film to discuss/debate. I’m real interested to hear your interpretations.
Keep the episodes coming; you along with JOTD and company have a great thing going here!!
Grey Imp
Did anyone get to watch Chappie? Personally I feel like Neill Blomkamp (along with Christopher Nolan) is putting out some of the best sci-fi of modern times, so I was looking forward to this movie so much. I have very mixed feelings about it. There’s a lot to like, but a lot to hate too.
We’re covering it on this show a few eps down the road (we’re back-logged because it took me so long to get the first ep edited and the site built and figure out a release date that would work well with HMP) … but Jason has got me really worried about Chappie. I have very high hopes, but it seems that he hated it outright. And he was even an Elysium apologist. Tune into MPW to find out, I guess. I may be making an appearance over there and William will be on there as well.
I think you’re going to hate certain aspects of the film even more than Jay. Based on your dislike of certain musical culture, I think you won’t be able to get past that. But I don’t want to speak for you, so please watch it soon and post your thoughts. I’m dying to know what everyone thinks. My boss, who is the smartest person I know, really liked it and he loved the one thing I hated most about this film. I don’t want to delve too deep into it before you see it. But I did find that very funny.
I just left a big, long comment for you over at MPW and I’m so curious to hear what your boss liked that you hated, but let’s take the convo over to TSFP Ep 3 boards to contain the convo. I think you’ll appreciate our review and I can’t wait to discuss this with you.
Hey guys and gal
Looking forward to digging into this! I haven’t had a chance to listen to the episode yet, but I will! Promise! 🙂
Okay. Here ya go. Do your worst.
TOP 10
1. The Thing
2. Invasion of the Body Snatchers
3. THX-1138
4. Star Wars (original trilogy)
5. Back to the Future
6. Blade Runner
7. 2001: A Space Odyssey
8. E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial
9. Upstream Color
10. Gattaca
OTHERS:
Alien, Alphaville, Barbarella, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, The Fly, Jurassic Park, Metropolis, Primer, RoboCop, Sunshine, They Live, Time Crimes, Twelve Monkeys
I also like Her, Inception, Interstellar, Robot & Frank, and Under the Skin but it’s too soon for me to call.
GUILTY PLEASURES
1. Bill & Ted’s Excellent Adventure
2. Flight of the Navigator
3. Ewok Adventure / The Battle For Endor
I just love how everyone’s lists are extremely different. It’s so cool and interesting. And the thing is, they’re all lists that I’d be proud to call my own.
Excellent Adventure over Bogus Journey? Hmmm very questionable choice there, but I’ll allow it since you’re implying that Bogus Journey is the better movie and so it doesn’t deserve to be in the guilty pleasure category.
Time Crimes is an excellent pick, Josh. I was going to include it, but I guess I deleted it at some point and forgot to bring it back. One of the coolest time travel movies for sure.
Upstream Color? Ugh! At least it’s not towards the top. haha.
Which Invasion of the Body Snatchers? I love both, but tend to prefer the original believe it or not.
I’ve never been able to watch THX-1138 in one sitting. It’s so sparse. And I love sparse, but that movie’s so sparse it becomes boring. Great visuals, great sound, great acting, just not enough there for me to love.
“Which Invasion of the Body Snatchers? I love both, but tend to prefer the original believe it or not.”
I believe Josh prefers the original too. Not me though.
Sorry, David. I was playing God and you got caught in the crossfire.
David, could you elaborate on why you prefer the re-make? They’re both great movies, and they’re actually very different. For me, the original has a much greater emotional impact on me. The characters and the script are more about relationships being destroyed. You can see and hear their pain and confusion in their eyes and voices when they are confronted with a loved one that doesn’t seem to really love them anymore. That’s scary to me. Perhaps the movie came at a time when in real life a loved one stopped loving me, so my feelings towards this topic were more exposed than ever, and the movie’s impact was certainly felt. But like I said, I love both films.
Me too, Juan. In fact, I like every incarnation of the Invasion movies, but my favorite is 1956. Also, that’s 1982’s The Thing, in case there is any doubt.
I honestly don’t understand how an intelligent movie-goer like yourself doesn’t appreciate Upstream Color. And I don’t know why everyone is so confused by it either. If you don’t like the pig reveal, okay. It’s different, but it at least serves its function and everything else in the film is so fascinating, mysterious and well done, in my opinion. I also find it to be extremely emotional despite its cold facade.
I feel similarly about THX, though I will give you that it is sparse.
Excellent Adventure over Bogus Journey? Yes way, Ted! http://bit.ly/1E1Nf94
Hahaha Josh! I’ve told you many times that I do appreciate it, I just don’t like it nearly as much as you do. I do find it odd that you decided to include it in your top ten, but not Contact because it’s too “new”.
There was no doubt in my mind that you were referring to John Carpenter’s The Thing. It’s a masterpiece and it pains me to not be able to include it in my list. It’s one of my favorite movies of all time, but it just doesn’t feel sci-fi enough for me.
I was saying that Interstellar was too new for me to know, not Contact. I was just surprised by Contact because I think it is an underrated film. I like it, I just wouldn’t rate it so high. And to be fair, I haven’t seen it since it came out.
Upstream Color, between all the times I initially love-watched it and all the times I’ve had to go back to defend it, I’m completely clear about how I feel and where I stand on it. I’ve ended up thinking about it way more than any other movie since it came out. In fact, it’s been through the wringer for me, I probably know it as well as many movies I like that are a decade older.
I think a big reason why everyone’s list is so different is because how we define science-fiction, as individuals, is highly subjective. THE THING, for example, isn’t a movie I would classify as sci-fi, but I can totally understand the argument for it being sci-fi.
There he is! Where’s your list, bro?!
Ha! Yeah, I’ve been crazy busy the last week+. I’ve been missing it around here…
I’m working on a list.
“9. Upstream Color”
I still need to get back to watching that! I’m sorry Josh but after I fell asleep the first time I’ve been in more of a courtroom drama/mystery thriller mood for some weird reason.
And that’s actually quite an interesting and in some ways surprising list Josh. “Invasion of the Body Snatchers” (the original I assume) above “Blade Runner” and “Star Wars”!
And I love that you included those Ewok movies. When I was a little kid there used to be this great shop just around the corner from my house which sold sweets and snacks and cheap toys (and porno magazines for some reason?) and it was owned by this really old, half blind Gurkha war veteran called Mr. Kahn. He also had a little video rental section but they tended to deal more in slightly obscure movies leftover from the 80’s than contemporary blockbusters. I remember renting “Return of the Jedi” on a tape from before the 1993(?) remaster and I also remember getting stuff like “Dark Crystal”, “The Neverending Story”, “Willow” and one/if not both of those Ewok flicks. It blew my mind as a young Star Wars fan in a pre-internet age to suddenly come upon these totally unknown movies set in the Star Wars universe.
Those were the days!
The Thing (1982) and Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1956) are two of my all-time favorite movies in any genre.
Star Wars and Back to the Future are on here for the place they hold in my heart as the most significant films of my childhood (along with the first three Indian Jones films), but The Thing has remained a movie that I can return to at any given time as an adult and I just can’t get enough.
Invasion was my first introduction to my favorite sub-genre and I do think it holds-up very nicely. Just a classic film.
Blade Runner and 2001 are, of course, masterworks and incredibly important films, but my enjoyment of those is more cerebral than the others on my list, which is why they rank lower for me.
On this side of the pond, the Ewok movies were on TV one a year for a few consecutive years. I remember the anticipation and being so excited to sit down for a TV event like. And then everyone would be talking about it at school on Monday. I seriously doubt that they hold up, hence the guilty pleasure.
I do own them on DVD, but I haven’t cracked the case yet for fear I’ll be disappointed.
Crap! I forgot Solaris. I’d have to knock one of the bottom 3 off to fit that in. And I actually quite like the 2002 version, but I’m talking about the 1972 version.
Two on my list of shame that I wonder if they’d make my list are Stalker (1979) and Darkstar (1974).
“Two on my list of shame that I wonder if they’d make my list are Stalker (1979) and Darkstar (1974).”
Those two are on my list of shame too.
Well I’ve seen some if not all of “Stalker” but it was a long time ago when I was even dumber than I am now and somewhat less patient with movies. I think I found it boring and depressing at the time but, like Mattroid, I also used to like the band Korn.
Knock Upstream Color!
I’ll kill you.
1. Flash Gordon
2. Hardware
3. Dreamscape
4. The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension
5. Repo Man
Yeah I know…I’m a sci fi weirdo…
Hope your recovery is going well Shannon. It’s good to see you commenting over here.
And that is one hell of a list. Just to clarify; those are your top 5 Sci-fi movies right? Not your guilty pleasures?
Either way those are some impressively left-field choices. I love “Flash Gordon” too. I know a lot of folks would call that a guilty pleasure but I don’t think I could bring myself to class it as such because it’s so self-aware and just so much fun!
“Repo Man” is one that I’ve been meaning to check out for the longest time but just haven’t gotten round to yet. It’s admittedly a pretty big oversight on my part and from everything I know about the movie it seems like something I would really love.
Man! Shannon, you are bold my friend. Always making the rest of us look like a bunch of pansies haha. Great list, man!
Shannon! How is the recovery going? You feeling ok?
I love your list. Totally unique and interesting.
I’m completely with you on Repo Man. Love it. I know Jay is a big Flash Gordon fan. I’ve never seen Hardware. Are you talking about the one from 1990? How is it? And I had a traumatic experience with Dreamscape as a kid and was always too scared to revisit it. I was actually considering it for a Wolfman’s Got Nards segment on HMP, but someone mocked me saying it wasn’t scary at all. What do you say?
I am doing well guys…my pain is pretty much gone and I’m just about done with my physical therapy…now I’ve just got to work on walking normal…gotta say those first 2 weeks were the worst weeks of my life but what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger…plus I’ve still got about 4 weeks left before I go back to work so things are good…I’m not sure I could make a top 10 list of my favorite sci fi movies and rank one over the others because the genre is so broad and vastly different from one movie to the next…I like all sci fi but the quirkier and more unique the better…Flash Gordon is by far my favorite…Its the movie I’ve seen the most…growing up I watched every chance I got and can still recite the movie word for word…wish I had the exact number of times I’ve seen it…its just some ridiculous amount…Its just so wonderfully strange and odd…one of a kind movie…Yes Josh…Hardware is the 1990 movie…I can’t do it justice by trying to describe it because its such a visual movie but its one the best low budget sci fi/horror movies ever made…As for Dreamscape… its not really scary now but as a kid that giant snake guy was pretty freaky…anyways…I love this podcast too and look forward to where it goes because there is such a wide array material to delve into…Great job people!!!
I’m glad to hear that you’re much better. Keep on truckin’!
Wow! Bravo! What a *stellar* maiden voyage of an episode! Well done, Mattdroid, Station and Solo (and Josh, of course). I am genuinely impressed with this podcast, and I love the show already. Love it!
I just submitted an iTunes review dubbing this show “The Soylent Green of Science Fiction Podcasts…” Why? Because it’s the best flavor — the one everybody loves the most (and that means something very troubling about you three and us listeners)…
Semi-substantive comment: Defining the Science Fiction Genre…
We horror fans have this same debate ad nauseam, but because we’re genre-lovers, we must. And we will. What is genre if not a classification system where film art is organized, sorted and identified by its conventions and recurring iconography?
A genre heading (such as “Science Fiction” or “Horror”) is nothing more than a skeletal structure, an overarching umbrella under which we can further parse films that incorporate other genre conventions and icons. Science Fiction has spaceships; Horror has monsters. If you blend the two, you get something like “Alien,” which is a genre hybrid: Sci-Fi Horror.
So, during your discussions in this episode, I was surprised that no one made the distinction that almost all of your debates were over these Sci-Fi, hybrid genre blends. Yes, “Star Wars” is clearly Sci-Fi Fantasy, or more accurately, Fantasy Sci-Fi. (I always list them with the most prominent genre classification first.) A Sci-Fi Fantasy and a Sci-Fi Horror are both still Sci-Fi films. My 2 Republican Credits…
Anyway, you have a new, bona fide fan here, and I will be listening to every episode faithfully. Thank you for the exceptional Sci-Fi Podcast — “The Soylent Green of Science Fiction Podcasts.”
JOTD
P.S. Station, I love you! — “Alien: Resurrection” 4-Eva, baby!
P.S. From JOTD: As if I haven’t written enough already… (Spoilers ahead for this episode of The Sci-Fi Podcast.)
1. I commend Captain Mattroid: The only choice for the No. 1 sci-fi flick of all time is Stanley Kubrick’s “2001: A Space Odyssey” (1968). Science Fiction has never reached greater heights.
2. The moment of silence for Leonard Nimoy was very classy. Impressed.
3. William and Mattroid’s sincere, heart-to-heart expressions about their lives and the important role that science fiction cinema has played during their good times and bad moved me to tears. That’s exactly why film art is so valuable to humanity.
Thank you again for this podcast. I’m hooked.
JOTD
Jason, my friend, these comments were both wonderful and too kind. Thanks for all your help, for letting me be a guest on HMP and for agreeing to guest on our show soon.
Your list is good, and your arguments make sense. I too wish we’d have gotten a little more into the “blends”, because it was a natural direction, but alas we didn’t make it there.
And thanks for the iTunes review!
Question for you: have you ever watched a sci-fi move while wearing just your underpants and eating lots of ice cream at the same time? I’m just curious is all.
>Jay of the Dead on March 12, 2015 at 12:55 am said:
“…I just submitted an iTunes review dubbing this show “The Soylent Green of Science Fiction Podcasts…” Why? Because it’s the best flavor — the one everybody loves the most…”
—
Sure, but would you say it’s the Peanut Buster Parfait of science fiction podcasts?
Jason,
Well said, good Sir.
I pretty much agree with your basic breakdown of genre. Especially for a starting point of a conversation.
But at the same time, I still know it, when I see it…
Most of the time.
It’s doesn’t have to be one way or another, does it?
Hey guys!
Long time listener to JOTD (going waaaaaay back to his weekly show) and I got to say I’ve finally found a worthy companion podcast! Mattroid… always liked when you made guest spots on the other program, so excited to hear what you guys got in store. Big time horror fan, but SF is my second love– particularly the sf’s that bleed into horror like “The Fly” and “Aliens” and “Splice.” Good luck with the show! can’t wait for more.
His Dinner Is In The Oven.
Hey HDIITO,
Thanks for the kind words. I love guesting on HMP. Make sure to check out the final F13 review episode this Friday, which I was fortunate enough to be on.
The SciFi show is going to be great, mostly because of our dynamic hosts and guests. And I’m with you; “The Fly”, “Aliens” and other sci-fi/horror tends to be my favorite because it combines my two genre loves.
Subscribe and spread the word!
Mattroid
Oh yeah, your name is from Fright Night, no? Station and I LOVE Fright Night. Love it. All three of them. (I don’t count the most recent FN2 because it’s absolute crap.)
Dude! Way to pick up on the handle. I LOVE the original Fright Night… Did not much care for the remake; thought it was a little pointless more than bad. I only watched the trailer for the sequel. The completist in me might watch it just for punishment.
Ok. I watched Chappie again and knowing what I didn’t know prior to watching it the first time, I liked it a lot more this time. I still have problems with it, but it’s great. I can’t wait to see what Blomkamp does with the Alien franchise.
Awesome. Make sure to check out our 4th episode where we review Chappie. It’ll be out pretty soon.
Right there with you on the Blomkamp Alien movie(s). Can’t wait.
>David on March 6, 2015 at 2:32 am said:
“I think the best argument to be made for Star Wars not properly fitting into the Sci-Fi genre is that it’s universe isn’t in some way scientifically rooted to our own. It shuffles off the limitations of our reasonable scientific speculations by emancipating itself from any association with the world as we see it. But to that I’d say: Don’t all films and stories in any medium do that to an extent? No film adheres actually and totally to the laws of our world as we know them. Even the most grounded movie has cuts and changes in character perception. But we understand that things operate differently when a narrative is being told as opposed to how an event might unfold before us in person.”
—
The more I think about it, the more I actually consider Star Wars to be pure fantasy containing “sci-fi elements,” and those sci-fi elements are essentially just the fact that it’s set in space. That is probably why people so readily consider it science fiction.
It’s true that most (if not all) sci-fi films will not adhere completely to the scientific rules of our universe. However, for a movie to be sci-fi there needs to be scientific explanation of some sort; it needs to be rooted in science (not necessarily sound science, but science nonetheless). The Millennium Falcon goes to light speed for no reason other than that it can, and we have to accept that. There are literally hundreds of different alien races intermingling with humans, but nobody bats an eye because there’s nothing exceptional about it. Characters jump from planet to planet, travelling through space the same way you or I would hop into our car to make a beer run. This is the universe the story has created. There’s no scientific basis explaining any of it, we just have to accept that this is how things are in this universe. That’s not “science” fiction; it’s just fiction.
Star Wars, at its heart, is a story rooted in fairy tale themes. Those themes have already been touched on – princess in distress, assault on the castle, roguish mercenary, etc – but it’s these themes that drive the story. Star Wars is never about space travel or alien races; it’s about going to Endor to disable the shield generator of the new Death Star and defeat the Empire. It is, essentially, about the battle between good and evil.
I think a major hang up of people classifying Star Wars as fantasy is that there are no elves, orcs, dwarves, trolls, wizards (debatable, I know), etc etc. Those are just surface elements common in fantasy, though. They don’t define fantasy. The fantasy genre is about stories rooted in spiritual themes (the force), battles between good and evil (Jedi vs. the dark side), overcoming temptation (resisting the dark side), friendship (many examples), courage (many examples), loyalty (many examples), growing up (Luke leaving home to discover his place in the world), etc.
Going back to the spiritual theme, when Obi Want sacrifices his life to help the rest of his group escape, he then becomes a spiritual presence guiding Luke through the remainder of the trilogy. There’s no science in that, it’s pure fantasy… except that it happens on a space station. More to the point, the mere inclusion of these sci-fi elements does not a sci-fi movie make.
And, if any doubt still remains, George Lucas himself referred to the story as a “space fantasy” to help guide the project.
Whoa! http://i.imgur.com/FOjjvmc.jpg
I probably should have prefaced my comments with the obvious “film, like all art, is subjective” disclaimer. We all interpret movies and genres differently. The “what is science fiction” and Star Wars discussions from Episode I really triggered my brain to start thinking about the genre at its core, something I’ve never really done before. The more I thought about it, the more I began focusing on the themes of the genre as opposed to surface elements. From there, it was much easier to categorize films in a way that makes sense to me.
In any event, thanks for kicking off with these discussions. The mental exercise really has helped me gain a better understanding of and fresh perspective on a genre I already loved.
This is a brilliant comment and it has my stance pretty much stumped. I need some time to reassess my approach!
Brilliant is as brilliant does, my momma always sed…
Dino,
I think there is enough here to at least prove, that you can look at Star Wars from a scientific tech point of view, and a fantasy point of view.
Star Wars Tech is a documentary about the technical aspects of Star Wars, from Darth Vader’s robotic limbs to the lightsaber to how an X-wing compares to modern jets. It also covers much, much more.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWID33zZlMY
“I’m not crazy… you’re the one that’s CRAZY”… 🙂
Oh man, Solo gave me homework. I started to watch this today, but didn’t get to finish it. I have some initial thoughts, but will wait until I can finish the full video before commenting.
Thanks for sharing the link.
@Solo – So, I watched Star Wars Tech. Thanks again for sharing the link. It was interesting, to say the least; especially the plasma technology discussed (plasma windows and force fields… what?!).
The elements discussed that fit most closely to the science fiction mold to me were the Vader suit/prosthetics and the droids (I would also add clones to the list, which were not discussed, if you want to get into the prequels). Thinking back to the films, I can maybe see enough there in the text of the movie to form a science fiction argument; mostly just in passing comments, though, like Luke saying “but you’ll die” to Vader when he wants to take off his mask at the end of RETURN.
The rest of the tech discussed, though, are examples of something similar to fan fiction, in my opinion. In other words, something that has been created after the fact to help explain elements of the movie. I’m not saying the movie needs to provide a blueprint for all of this future technology. I’m not even saying that it needs to be rooted in real or sound science… I can accept the conceit that this takes place in a different galaxy with presumably different rules of physics, etc. But, I think there needs to at least be some foundation in “how it works.” More often than not, in Star Wars, everything just works because it does.
All that said, I would not fault anyone for arguing Star Wars as science fiction, I just wouldn’t necessarily agree with them.
I guess we could call Star Wars soft science fiction. From Wikipedia:
Soft science fiction — focus on human characters and their relations and feelings, while de-emphasizing the details of technological hardware and physical laws
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outline_of_science_fiction#Genres_of_science_fiction
To me, though, that’s just another way of saying “fantasy w/sci-fi elements.”
Dino for the win.
I just took a screenshot of that^ and plan to use it frequently in boardroom discussions at work and bowling alley disagreements in the future.
On second thought, it would look nice as a blown up print out hung on the ceiling above my bed…
Seriously, though, it’s your discussion on this maiden voyage that prompted me to think more deeply about science fiction than I ever thought I would.
And, for that, I say “thanks?”….
Thanks? works. Ha ha.
Your top 10 is great, man. Super great. But I gotta get with David on this…you’ve haven’t seen Blade Runner in how long?!
If I had to guess, I’d say it’s been about 22 years. I know it was when I was in junior high.
I plan on watching it again sometime this week, now that my Friday the 13th re-watching marathon is over.
Ok, here we go…
My Top 10 Sci-Fi Films of All Time (as of now):
1. 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY (1968)
2. ALIEN (1979)
3. ALIENS (1986)
4. THE TERMINATOR (1984)
5. INTERSTELLAR (2014)
6. EVENT HORIZON (1997)
7. PREDATOR (1987)
8. MINORITY REPORT (2002)
9. PROMETHEUS (2012)
10. THE MATRIX (1999)
It’s a virtual dead heat between 2001 and ALIEN for my top spot, but I give the slight edge to Kubrick. Interestingly, Kubrick and Ridley Scott basically duke it out for top spot on my favorite horror list, too.
I struggled with where to place INTERSTELLAR. I knew it was in my top 10 – I love how the film deals with spacetime and relativity – but being so new I wasn’t exactly sure where it would fall. Another recent film I gave serious consideration to is GRAVITY (2013), but I’m still on the fence as to how I classify that film. I’m leaning towards including it as science fiction, which would likely slot it on my list just behind MINORITY REPORT. I didn’t include the STAR WARS films (namely, A NEW HOPE and THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK) because I consider them to be fantasy films.
Other movies that narrowly missed my top 10 include TERMINATOR 2: JUDGMENT DAY (1991), EDGE OF TOMORROW (2014), INCEPTION (2010), JURASSIC PARK (1993), SUNSHINE (2007), and THE FLY (1986), to name a few.
My Top (3) Guilty Pleasures:
– BACK TO THE FUTURE (1985)
– ESCAPE FROM NEW YORK (1981)
– STARGATE (1994)
– TRON: LEGACY (2010)
– OBLIVION (2013)
I know, I know, that’s^ five… but I truly “love” TRON: LEGACY and OBLIVION, and feel utterly guilty about it.
I also have a rather large… list of shame (get your mind out of the gutter, Juan), filled with tons of sci-fi classics that could (presumably) land in my top 10 when I finally get around to seeing them.
My List of Shame:
– BLADE RUNNER (1982)
– BRAZIL (1985)
– CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND (1977)
– INVASION OF THE BODY SNATCHERS (1956)
– INVASION OF THE BODY SNATCHERS (1978)
– METROPOLIS (1927)
– MOON (2009)
– SERENITY (2005)
– SOLARIS (1972)
– THE FIFTH ELEMENT (1997)
– TOTAL RECALL (1990)
– TWELVE MONKEYS (1995)
I’ve seen BLADE RUNNER, TWELVE MONKEYS, and TOTAL RECALL before, but a long time ago and I can’t remember them for the life of me. Need to give them a proper re-watch, so I’m counting them as unseen.
I love lists, but I also hate them. I’m sure there are a bunch of worthy movies I’m forgetting…
You’ve never seen “Blade Runner” Dino!?
Holy fuck!
No, I have seen it, but only once about 25+ years ago. I can’t really remember it, apart from a few scenes here and there. I need to give it a re-watch.
It’s currently streaming on HBO GO in the U.S., so I’ll watch it again soon.
That is a great top ten list though!
Thanks. Probably a little humdrum, but there it is.
I struggled with Gravity too, Dino (that’s what she said) and I’m still struggling with it. I’d like to hear everyone’s opinion on it. But yeah, if I ever make my mind about it, it’ll land in my top 10 for sure.
I need to give it a re-watch to decide where I stand. The first (and only) time I watched it, I was so caught up on the emotional ride and thrilling tension; I was fully engrossed in the film, but not really paying attention. So, when I think back about the movie, all I remember are the emotions and stress I felt.
Know what I mean?
Hmm I’m not sure if you’re trying to set up a “that’s what she said joke”, because I think you are, but I just don’t see it haha. But yeah, I know what you mean. I watched it twice on IMAX and I had the same experience both times. Just a jaw-dropping, intense, visually stunning, tense, scary, aurally impressive heavily emotional ride. Did you watch it on IMAX? It’s the only way to watch that movie, man.
Man, I really got you en garde with the double entendres. I wasn’t actually setting anything up there, though. The “know what I mean” comment was more in reference to the being “fully engrossed in the film, but not really paying attention” line. I know that happens to me a lot, but wasn’t sure if others experience it, too.
Unfortunately, I did not see GRAVITY in IMAX. I wish I had. My viewing was in the comfort of my own home, on a puny 42″ plasma.
Would you say the IMAX experience was… stimulating?
Haha. you guys are the best!
Not as stimulating as you or David, but it was up there 😉
I’m a little surprised that not ONE of you mentioned that the artwork for this “IT’s Science Fiction!” episode came from the “IT Came From Outer Space!” movie poster. Is it just that obvious … or are y’all a bunch of posers masquerading as sic-fi fans?
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